Week 4: Kid Clutter

• I’ve been the jerk toy Nazi since my son was born (he’s almost 4) and I routinely make items disappear when he’s not looking. He will sometimes ask for them back, and I will tell him they are gone, and that is that. It’s getting harder now that he asks where they went, and he protests more, but ultimately, like you mentioned, the toys are in my house which I pay for, and if I’m not keen to store them then they are going. I have a rule that if something is electronic, not played with every day, or just plain junky, then it goes, new or not. Plus we only keep what fits in his toy box and toy bins, which isn’t really that many items. I love this post. My attitude about the toys is validated. Right on!

• I always involved my kids in the decisions of what to give away. I think it helps develop an awareness of passing on the blessing and helps them realize they can give away an item that was a present without it damaging the relationship with the giver. As another person noted, she was surprised about what her kids were willing to give away, I was also surprised by items that they wanted to keep. Talking to them about why certain things were important to them can be a real opportunity to learn about your child.

• This is such a great post, Rachel! I completely agree that parents are responsible for what their children have, and as the parent, have a right to limit what they have. When this is done in a loving way (i.e., too much stuff is unhealthy for my child’s development, therefore I will not allow them to have too much stuff), it’s kindness, not harshness!

  I think my five year old is at a point where I need to start teaching him how to declutter. He is naturally attached to things, and has always had an EXCELLENT memory (even at 3 and 4, he would bring up insignificant items that I’d gotten rid of at least a year previously, and express sadness that they were gone! Despite the fact that they were broken or unloved at the time!). So while I usually declutter without my 5, 3, and 11 month old present (not that the baby cares!), I think it’s time for us to have some discussion about why we get rid of some things. I’d like for that to become a normal part of their thought process.

  Recently, I purchased an art easel for them — it was something they really wanted. However, we had a past-its-prime rocking horse at home, so I explained to them that if they wanted to get the easel, we’d need to get rid of the rocking horse to make room for it. They considered this, and chose in favor of the easel. I would have been comfortable just getting rid of the horse, but (hopefully) their ability to participate in the decision planted some seeds.

  I’m feeling inspired to curate our toys even more!

  Cheers,
  Shannon

• A friend linked to this (very similar) article yesterday, which I very much agreed with. http://www.modbee.com/news/nation-world/national/article56473378.html
  We have four kids- 7, 5, 3, and 1. My older two are a part of the toy purging conversation most of the time and my younger two mostly are not. There’s a time for both approaches, when done thoughtfully. I have certainly gotten rid of things my kids have asked about later. That’s okay, too. We talk through it:)

• We stopped to make toys disappear after the kids were big enough to select and donate toys to other children themselves.
  Also, there are a few toys that they are allowed to put away (ie up to the attic) for their own children. So far, my kids don’t seem to be at disadvantage by never having too many, too loud or any ‘educational’ toys. 🙂 In fact, they say they feel overwhelmed and annoyed in some of their friends’ playroom with endless toys, pieces of toys that don’t work and toys that their owner doesn’t even know how to play with. 🙂

• I agree with an earlier comment that teaching our kids how to deal with their stuff is a long term goal. We have a permanent “give away box” that is always open for contributions.
  I find it also helps to have a kid in mind who might be next in line, maybe a neighbor or cousin who would be really happy to have the stuff. Then, it’s a matter of asking, “Do you think Suzy is ready for this?” Instead of the dubious, “Are you ready to get rid of this?”
  Also, did you know that Santa takes old toys to repair and give away next year? On Christmas Eve, along with milk and cookies, the kids leave out a Santa sack with at least one item to send back into the flow of toys.
  Now that these ideas are standard for us, they are not as difficult as once anticipated. The kids now being up the idea themselves, “I’m done with this; Can we give this to…” If you are hesitant to try have your kids involved, I recommend starting sooner than later. The short term pain is worth the long term gain: a clutter free house and children learning to live free of the burden of stuff.

• I have 2 girls – ages 10 and 6. I tend to gather toys and “stage” them out of sight for donation in the basement. It usually takes a month or longer before a scheduled donation pickup. If they don’t ask for it in that time I figure it’s good to go. I think I’ve only had to retrieve a toy from the basement twice in the 3 years I’ve been doing this. My oldest has zero ability to declutter and will insist on the utter preciousness of every single item she owns. It is not worth the fight when I have a pretty good grasp of which toys actually have staying power when out of sight. But in general, I agree, it’s my house and I get to say what stays and what goes.

• .OK so I’ve been waiting for you to get round to kid clutter, to ask you this. What do you do (what will you personally do) if your kids have a different attitude to clutter than you?

  One of my children has a bedroom which, to my eyes, is chock full of clutter. But one summer, we stayed in a friend’s house. That house also felt to me chock full of clutter – I felt I couldn’t move, couldn’t breath in it. A while later, my son referred to that house as “that lovely house, so full of interesting things… I want my house to be just like that when I’m a grown up”. (And indeed the house did belong to a family who have travelled widely and lived in several places abroad, so the “clutter” is interesting and exotic and evocative.) I realised that we just have a different attitude. From then on, I stopped trying to make him tidy, and keep the room minimalist. I relaxed, and let him have all his little knick-knacks out on display (and I hardly ever dust, but have learnt to get over that). He’s now 15, and his room is still full of bits and pieces, things that friends have given him, “special” items, things that hold memories for him. He’s just not a minimalist. He’s comfortable when he has stuff around.

  I’ve dealt with it by saying that the kids can keep their bedrooms as they want, but the rest of the house, it’s my/my husband’s rules. Doesn’t entirely work, but that’s how we muddle along. I’m interested to know if you’ve thought about how it will be for you when your children are old enough to have more of a say in the way the house is. Maybe they won’t be minimalists, in spite of your best training!

  • Antonia – so you have a collector and appreciator of many little beautiful things! Wonderful. Ultimately each parent knows what will work for their kids and family. I think we will have an issue with any of our kids being collectors of things because we simply won’t ever have the room for big collections. Also, our kids will share a room for most of their childhood – perhaps the oldest will get his own room from 16-18. They will have to manage sharing a room and living in a small space. There won’t be a lot of room for collecting.
    If we were living in a larger home, our kids had their rooms and they were older, I would give them more free reign over what they have with some checks and balances. Perhaps the room had to be tidied once a week and they need pare down if their belongings can’t fit in their space.
    And they’re not minimalists yet, despite my training! They do love things and toys. They tend to get overwhelmed with gifts in the late fall and holiday season (fall birthdays) and there are a few months of “I want, I want, I want”. But it calms down eventually. And we are trying to get across the points that we simply do not have the space for a lot of stuff, things cost us in money and time and, the big one, they have plenty already. I think one thing that helps is that they don’t see a lot of commercials for toys and such (what they watch is mostly on Netflix) and my oldest, our first school-goer, is a bit of a dreamer and not very aware or savvy of stuff. The biggest thing he has picked up at school is a frenzy for Star Wars – we watched one of the movies, picked up some Star Wars related books at the library and that satisfied him (no action figure required!).
    My kids are young but I am hopeful. I’ve had other parents weigh in, ones with large families and older kids, and they’ve been able to keep the clutter at bay. Time will tell!
    Good luck to you and thanks for commenting.

    • I think that, as kids get older, space becomes a different issue. Our two boys are bigger than us now, and my 11 year old daughter is coming up behind. The house feels smaller and smaller as time goes by. A bedroom that’s a little small for two young kids might feel horribly claustrophobic when they are both 6 foot tall. A sitting room with a sofa that seats two adults and a couple of kids easily is fine, till the kids are adult-sized too.

      Bringing up children is always a moving target. I hadn’t realised how much I would crave space, as mine got older.

      • Antonia – thanks for sharing your perspective as a parent with bigger and older children. As our boys are likely to be 6’5″ or so I am concerned about space in the future. We have a tentative plan to rent a house for their high school years. But if that doesn’t work out we will make do with our condo. I know families in other high priced cities like New York do it and in Europe so we will do as they do. Living in a smaller home was a choice for us when we started our minimalist-ish journey but our city (Vancouver) has become highly unaffordable in the last five years. I’m not sure what the future holds for us here but only time will tell.
        Thanks for commenting 🙂 Rachel

• I have 15 and 17 year old boys. I’ve just done a sort out of all their Lego and war hammer toys. So many little parts. Lego for older kids is vastly different to the younger Lego. The challenge is in making the model up and not reinventing it again into something else. Sadly. It’s not much use to anyone without the set of instructions.p and the made up model just ends up gathering dust.

  I’ve sorted and labelled stuff into shoe boxes and then dated it. I’ll keep it for 6-12 months and then revisit it again. I sold off some of my sons beyblades a few years ago, then my son got interested in them again and asked where they were as they had turned into collectibles. He has not trusted me since. To be honest I do like to keep some favourite toys even if they have outgrown them. We have the space to store a few and they are handy when you get younger kids visiting. Saves your house and kitchen drawers getting dismantled…

  The kids as they grow up want less and less of the physical toys as they get more into electronics and iPads etc. the toys get smaller and smaller. Have to watch the gadget clutter as they get older!

  • Thanks for chiming in Karin. Good to hear from parents of older kids.

• I have a 3.5 year old and a 6 year old. We recently did a 20 toy challenge my eldest negotiated and it turned into a 25 toy challenge. We pulled every toy out and the put 25 in a big plastic tub. I was surprised by what my 3.5 year old picked. She rediscovered quite a few toys that I would have chosen to donate. My 6 year old picked exactly what I would have chosen for her.

  I am pleased to say they have both kept their rooms clean for about a week and a half now as it really only takes 2 minutes for them to clean it up.

• It’s like anything else – we have absolute control over our kids when they’re young, but we teach them how to do it themselves as they get older. A 2 or 3 year old won’t really notice the random plastic rubbish disappearing, but an 8 year old will. We can feed our kids fantastic healthy meals as toddlers, but they need to know why and how to make them as teenagers so they make smart choices when on their own.

  My Mum is 65 and still remembers and resents her Mum giving away everything she left at home when she moved out at 17. She may not have wanted to keep all of it but the lack of consultation and choice still rankles.

  My stuff is free to go, other people’s I wait for permission and try to model why it’s such a good idea to have less. It’s slower but working with the kiddo.

• I read a lot about getting kids involved in the process when they are old enough. I’ve read some who say involve them as young as 3. And I’m curious what age you (or any other readers) started involving your kids. When are they mature enough to be part of the process of trimming down their full room?

  • My kids were old enough at around 3-4 to start picking toys to give away.

• I guess I must have indoctrinated my kid early. I think it’s really possible to involve even little kids in this. When she was 2 or 3 and got new toys, she would always ask me where they went. We ended up falling into a pattern of thinning at each birthday and Christmas. I don’t remember having to sneak out anything at night but I HAVE had to wait a frustratingly long time on some items I knew she wasn’t using. Now that she’s 11, she kinda brings it up on her own. I’m happy to know she won’t be burdened dragging a bunch of ‘stuff’ through life.

• I do not trick my kids. Once a season, my kids and I go through our things and items we’re not sure of go in a large tupperware bin in the closet. Everyone knows that if it’s not missed in a month, it’s donated. Easy peasy.

• I don’t take anything without talking to my kids about it anymore. I used to … with mixed results. Sometimes no one noticed, but sometimes my kids felt really cheated and angry. For about the past five years or more, I’ve worked with my kids to see what can be donated or thrown away and want they want to keep. We talk about what things are really important and why, and we talk about blessing others with items we no longer need. With my two oldest (17 and 15) it was a tough transition, but we’ve definitely “gotten there.” With my youngest who is 5, it’s no trouble at all. She routinely brings me toys and asks me to donate them. It’s important to me that they learn what manageable looks like and how to get there.

• My husband had his toys “disappear” on him regularly as a child. He was the youngest of four. He hated it, and still has deep resentment now. One of his favourite toy sets got disappeared one day because his mum hadn’t noticed he still played with it.

  He has a serious problem about throwing anything away as an adult and tends to hoard. I do wonder what influences his childhood experiences have on his need to hold onto things.

  Thwre are so many other more respectful ways to encourage your kids to get rid of stuff. Donating. Selling (my six ear olds love to sell their stuff on eBay and get the money – money could be spent on days out and even if it’s spent on stuff – new stuff costs more so you end up with less overall!). Discussing what space and time will give them.

  Make them in charge of tidying and cleaning everything up and suggest they downsize when they are struggling.

  When mine were younger I would hide everything in the loft for six months before getting rid. But even now they occasionally complain something suddenly amazing is missing and I may have to buy back one or two things.

  But no. Don’t throw away your kids stuff without any discussion! There’s no need.

• We sometimes allow the children to assist in the decision of what stays or goes. If it’s not picked up at night I take it, put it where they can’t find it and they can earn it back through good behavior or chores. I give them back their toys for Christmas or birthday presents too. After me taking a toy 3 times it’s out of our house. They know the rules and keep their stuff picked up. It’s been that way since our oldest, now 15.5 years old, was little. Currently all the toys in our house fit into one banker’s box and they care for them well.

  • Thanks for sharing. You are the alpha parent 🙂

• I’ve always limited the toys, and like you, when my kids were much younger I decluttered without their permission. Now they are older and are reasonably good at decluttering on their own. I’ve set a pattern of one in / one out and they know this keeps us all sane.

  • Jill – thank you for weighing in on this. So helpful to hear that modeling and working on this from a young age pays off. 🙂

• THANK you for that link, I loved it. Seriously I do NOT understand the parents who talk about how it’s wrong to declutter kids’ toys. We limit choices in all areas of their kids’ lives: I don’t allow junk food in my home, I don’t allow profanity or violent movies, I help my kids get enough rest, turn off the WiFi at night, etc… how is clutter any different?

  As parents, we KNOW that our kids get overwhelmed when they have too much. They also appreciate it less. We know best, period. That doesn’t mean we can’t get our kids input or help when we declutter, or that we would throw away precious things. But seriously, limits and boundaries are what kids need in their lives, more than ever in our modern world where everything is instant and there are limitless options.

  • Carrie – thank you so much for weighing in on this. So helpful to hear from a parent with older and younger kids. It’s so easy for me to say we do it like X but I really have no reference for how this will work when my kids are older. That article really hit home for me that I have to stick to the rules and continue to show my kids that yes, they have feelings and we respect them and are here to listen and help, but we rule this ship.

• Great article. I have three sons ages 17, 13 and 7. I totally agree with going through and editing your children’s toys. Kids can’t deal with a lot of stimulation and clutter any better than adults can. If your child has been fussy, fighting, or “bored”, then it is time to clean their toys out. Take out half or more of their stuff, leaving plenty of floor space and I promise they will go spend time playing in their room with the last three toys you leave in there. I have not once done this to my kids rooms without them saying “Thank you Mommy!” Another thought on limiting little kids toys, never leave out more toys than YOU want to pick up. If it is to much for an adult to deal with, think how frustrating and overwhelmed a preschooler would be. When a child is big enough to start making decisions about what he wants to keep, start the cluttering process with them. This is an incredibly important skill that kids need to develop. You may be surprised at how little kids really want. When mine were little, they loved their bikes, legos, a football,nerf guns, their chickens and of course any stray dog that wanted to move in.

  • Mindy – great tip about not leaving out more toys than you would want to pick up. Our baby keep dumping out the box of Legos and my older two get overwhelmed with having to pick all the pieces up. So true that the threshold for little kids is low. My kids can put a dozen books back on the book shelf but 100 pieces of Lego defeats them. Great tips – thank you!

• We do both as my oldest is now 6 and had a crazy memory. Plastic dodads get chucked by me, but I try to do the bigger toys with him. I’d like him to learn how to let go of things as he grows up. Sometimes I’m surprised at what he is willing to part with when I give him the opportunity.

  • Thanks for weighing in Brooke. My 6 year old is only now starting to remember toys – some that we gave away before the move – and ask about them. He’s not too attached to things (except trains!) so I’m lucky in that regard.

• This is a tough one for me. I’ve always been more in favor of getting rid of things in the middle of the night, but this has gotten trickier as my kids have gotten older (my oldest is seven), since they have insane memories and will ask for a toy they haven’t seen in a year. Also, I’m starting to have the opinion that I want to start teaching them about how to cull their own belongings, since that’s a skill I want them to have. While I am definitely in favor of parents being in charge, I also want to respect my kids and their wishes, too. However, my kids aren’t big fans of getting rid of stuff, so that doesn’t always go how I’d like! So I would say that we do a bit of both strategies right now.

  • I think this is a pretty common strategy for finding a middle ground on toys and kid stuff. Thanks for sharing!

• Great post! It is time that we all wake up and realize that Kids don’t need a lot of toys. The more they have the more bored they seem to be. It took me a long time to understand this. When my 11 year old was younger, if she started to fuss we thought she must be bored and went out and bought a new toy. The toys accumulated to a ridiculous amount – and guess what she was always bored. We are not making the same mistake with our almost 2 year old. The only toys she has is a handmade wooden barn from her Godfather with wooden animals and some little people to go with it as well as a box of blocks, a basket of books, a wooden pram and 1 doll. We’ve saved only Lego Duplo, Play kitchen and wooden train track from our older two children – but they will come out one at a time and we plan to give them to her on her birthday. She is the most content little girl and is not missing out at all. She also loves to explore her siblings rooms.

  We are slowly undoing the “damage” we did with our older daughter – who is still very materialistic. She however recently asked to move to the smaller bedroom in our home. Instead of choosing what she wanted to throw/give away we focused on what she loved and wanted to keep. This made it a much easier process and she is now enjoying her new bedroom with only her special things.

  • Thanks for sharing Kristin. I completely agree: most bored kids need fewer toys, not more.

• When my daughter turned 6 this was a turning point for us. She was old enough to say that she didn’t want some of her toys anymore and we gave a huge amount away. We also used birthdays and Hanuka to stock up on box games that are more age appropriate (they type that say age 7 – 99). I do sometimes chuck out an old plastic dooda without telling her but some toys are not played with for ages and then she’ll suddenly discover it again and get hours of entertainment out of it. I tend to be mre lenient with toys as long as they stay in her bedroom.

  • Thanks for sharing 🙂 Great to hear how other parents tackle this problem.

• Well said! I did a konmari cleanup, requiring all toys to be on the floor at once, from every room in the house. I was shocked! I could not reach my living room anymore. Big wake-up call! Now try to divide between me just getting rid of stuff without telling and pur oldest (4,5y) also donating a number of things. I set the number, she decides. Hopefully this gets her into a good habbit.

  • Nice work, Eve!

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